Can a joystick damage an MSX?

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By hamlet

Scribe (4106)

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08-10-2020, 00:28

Made my day!

By The Apeman

Master (242)

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08-10-2020, 22:15

The Apeman wrote:
Meits wrote:

They say it's MSX compatible. You could ask for the pin-out if you're not sure.

Thanks, I'll do that. So if the pin-out is not compatible, can it damage the MSX?

I finally got a response Sad :

Retrocables wrote:

The manfacuturer of the controller don't publish the pinout, but shoudl
be the standard atari joystick and paddle mix:

https://old.pinouts.ru/InputCables/atari_paddle_pinout.shtml

https://old.pinouts.ru/InputCables/JoystickAtari2600.shtml

By meits

Scribe (6534)

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08-10-2020, 23:53

I can't speak for the paddle as I never saw one in real life.
If they wired the joystick like that, that's a working one firebutton MSX compatible joystick. (see wiki)

By The Apeman

Master (242)

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09-10-2020, 08:18

Agreed. I don't think their response is an answer. That their manufacturer won't let them know the pin-out is questionable behaviour imo. Electronics is not my comfort zone and even then I don't see how I can open up a plastic plug like that, so I'm throwing it away.

By meits

Scribe (6534)

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09-10-2020, 10:17

Before you do that, let me test it for you. If it works I'll send it back to you. I do have some trust in the device.

By Accumulator

Master (169)

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05-11-2022, 18:45

Yes and no, It can damage your joystick port, but not brick your MSX
Back in the 90's for some demo application to have a Full screen scrolling over 2 MSX and 2 monitors. I connected 2 MSX joystick ports together, joystick port A (Machine A) and Joystick port A (Machine B)
Depending on the distance between monitors (Manually measured) the scrolling moved from Monitor B to Monitor A. Smoothly!
However.. in the process I killed one USB port, (short circuit or maybe over voltage, probably short circuit) ... Still sorry RemcoZ, Later Konami did the same with cable for F1 spirit 3D special to play with contestor on another MSX

Also it is sad MSX did not use some joystick/joypad trigger locations together to get additional fire buttons. This only works with pad/controller when you are not able to press left and right, up and down, upleft and downright, at the same time. Those combinations could be used for additional fire buttons .So, firing different projectiles with additional buttons, which are infact impossible movents together.

After 30 years a complete new joystick/joypad can be designed with approx 10 fire buttons...

By aoineko

Paladin (899)

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06-11-2022, 00:10

Accumulator wrote:

Also it is sad MSX did not use some joystick/joypad trigger locations together to get additional fire buttons. This only works with pad/controller when you are not able to press left and right, up and down, upleft and downright, at the same time. Those combinations could be used for additional fire buttons .So, firing different projectiles with additional buttons, which are infact impossible movents together.

After 30 years a complete new joystick/joypad can be designed with approx 10 fire buttons...

I thought of this solution but the problem is that if, for example, we use the up+down bits to detect a button, we can't detect these directions any more while the button is pressed.

It's not a big deal for Select/Run buttons like for FM Towns, but we can't use those buttons in an action game.

By gdx

Enlighted (6116)

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06-11-2022, 01:14

Accumulator wrote:

Also it is sad MSX did not use some joystick/joypad trigger locations together to get additional fire buttons.

Additional fire buttons can't be add easily. On MSX we have not Joystick ports but "general port". By cons, although it is possible, the standard has not defined a method. So we can do it but it will be a specific joystick, like the Arkanoid paddle controller for example. I think that's why no one has made a joystick with more than two buttons.

aoineko wrote:

I thought of this solution but the problem is that if, for example, we use the up+down bits to detect a button, we can't detect these directions any more while the button is pressed.

It's not a big deal for Select/Run buttons like for FM Towns, but we can't use those buttons in an action game.

We have already spoken about this several times on MRC. It's not a problem for most situations. In general, the extra buttons are used to pause, give up, throw a bomb that destroys all enemies on the screen, or bring up an options menu, etc. It's not annoying at all that we can't use the steering when pressing its additional buttons. There are some patches to use the Run and Select buttons of FM-Towns controllers on Konami games. All are action games. It's still much more pleasant to press the Run or Select buttons instead of the F1 or F5 keys for example.

By aoineko

Paladin (899)

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06-11-2022, 02:14

That's what I said.
The Accumulator's message made it sound like it would be easy to add buttons for gameplay, which is not the case. For example, in my tennis game, it's not acceptable to lose control of directions when you press a trigger.
If we add these buttons, they wouldn't be "normal" buttons.
The only clean solution I found is to add a 3rd button when the 2 buttons are pressed (I use it for a 3rd type of shot in my tennis game).

By Accumulator

Master (169)

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09-11-2022, 21:18

You need to design a new controller and change port reader actions. The controller can only be used with applications designed for it and not normal.
Also a dual controller , 2 cyclones, and 2 fire buttons , could be possible. One for direction of player, one for direction of fire direction and a and B fire button.
Theoretically....

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